I noticed that Clinton, in referring to Democrat candidates, managed not to mention Dennis Kucinich--unless I missed it. I wonder why that is.

Anyone else think Clinton is now so big on giving because he got in so much trouble for 'receiving'?

Just in case you guys need my contact info, here it is:

Huh?

Huh?

Just someone pissed off for some reason who thinks posting my personal information will teach me some sort of lesson or something. Pretty pathetic, but then assholes will be assholes.

Oh My Non-Existent God! Can you imagine Dubya talking about things being a million years old and that homo sapiens 'rose up'/evolved??

WHY DID THEY IMPEACH HIM?! Geez..

If anyone wants to be a politician in the future, watch Bill and take notes, because man, he just comes off classy, even when given the chance to be smarmy. It's easy to see why history will be kind to him.

This is why I would choose Hillary over anyone else. With Bill Clinton at Hillary's side, why would we need Obama or Edwards? If anyone was listening to the Aspen Ideas festival on NPR, Bill Clinton was interviewed for an hour, and I realized I relate to him more than any other politician. He layed out how we could boost the economy like a genius.

If anyone is interested in the interview, here's the site: Bill Clinton: Aspen Ideas Festival

Bill looks better all the time compared to Dubya. No one died when Willie lied!

It's easy to see why history will be kind to him.

Yeah, particularly when people are willing to forget that he created the current Sudan crisis by bombing the Al-Shifa pharmaceutical factory, just to distract people from the fact that he was having sex in the Oval Office. Class act all around. Let's elect his wife and continue the dynasty mentality.

"... distract people... "

The biggest distraction during President Clinton's administration was the bogus impeachment by the GOP Congress, which also did nothing to support his fight against terrorism.

he created the current Sudan crisis by bombing the Al-Shifa pharmaceutical factory

It is hard to say whether TeaBagger gets dumber or more disingenuous with every comment. Clinton created the Sudan current crisis because he destroyed a single factory while acting on bad intelligence? Are you saying that one destroyed factory created starvation and ethnic strife? This is the same TeaBagger who has defended Bush & Co. every step of the way in this disastrous war in Iraq. I can’t say that I’m a Hilary fan but I certainly prefer the Clinton dynasty to the Bush aristocracy.

Clinton is admired all over the world. He is intelligent and well-spoken. Since leaving office he has continued to work for the public good. I am proud to say that he was my president and that I voted for him twice. I always enjoy hearing what he has to say. He truly is a class act.

@ TeaForTheTillerman

First of all, to label that as a distraction is just rediculous. He made a horrible mistake, because he thought the pharmaceutical factory had ties to Osama Bin Laden and was producing VX Nerve gas. It is a bit of deja vu, I admit. The administration said they ordered the attack on "physical and circumstantial evidence" and those involved were "totally confident" the information was correct. - Washington Post. Except the aftermath was different.

Since his presidency, Bill Clinton has done everything he can for Africa. This shows me a man who learns from his mistakes and tries to make up for them. This is a rarity in politicians, and it is why I support him.

And don't bring up this "dynasty" shit. Just because they come from the same family, has nothing to do how well Hillary will perform in office. It's just a low blow, and very republican-ish.

...he created the current Sudan crisis by bombing the Al-Shifa pharmaceutical factory, just to distract people from the fact that he was having sex in the Oval Office.

... And then Republicans cried foul, claiming that Clinton's attempt to go after bin Laden was a "Wag the Dog"-scenario: that wily bastard is trying to distract the nation from the super-important fact that this sexually perverted man got a dirty, extramarital, not-approved-by-God, filthy blowjob!

Clinton created the Sudan current crisis because he destroyed a single factory while acting on bad intelligence? Are you saying that one destroyed factory created starvation and ethnic strife?

I'm not saying it. The same international organizations whose findings you use to criticize every action of the current administration are saying it:

One need to only look at the Clinton administration’s 1998 bombing of the Al-Shifa plant in Sudan to find U.S. terrorism. The bombing of Sudan, a response to the U.S. embassy bombings in Africa, was responsible for an large amount of deaths. To measure the death toll, it is necessary to examine not only the amount of deaths produced by the bombings, but also those deaths directly related to the bombings, that is the deaths caused by the eradication of the Al-Shifa plant. In his investigation of the bombing, Jonathan Belke of the Boston Globe, regional program manager for the Near East Foundation, a respected development institution providing technical assistance to poor countries in the Middle East and Africa, found that a year after the attack, “without the lifesaving medicine [the destroyed facilities] produced, Sudan’s death toll from the bombing has continued, quietly, to rise... Thus, tens of thousands of people-many of them children-have suffered and died from malaria, tuberculosis, and other treatable diseases... [Al-Shifa] provided affordable medicine for humans and all the locally available veterinary medicine in Sudan. It produced 90 percent of Sudan’s major pharmaceutical products... Sanctions against Sudan make it impossible to import adequate amounts of medicines required to cover the serious gap left by the plant’s destruction.” Germany’s Ambassador to Sudan writes that “It is difficult to assess how many people in this poor African country died as a consequence of the destruction of the Al-Shifa factory, but several tens of thousands seems a reasonable guess” (Werner Daum, “Universalism and the West,” Harvard International Review, Summer 2001). After all, Al-Shifa “provided 50 percent of Sudan’s medicines, and its destruction has left the country with no supplies of chloroquine, the standard treatment for malaria” (Patrick Wintour, Observer, December 20, 1998). Additionally, Al-Shifa was “the only one producing TB drugs-for more than 100,000 patients, at about 1 British pound a month. Costlier imported versions are not an option for most of them-or for their husbands, wives and children, who will have been infected since. Al-Shifa was also the only factory making veterinary drugs in this vast, mostly pastoralist, country. Its specialty was drugs to kill the parasites which pass from herds to herders, one of Sudan's principal causes of infant mortality” (James Astill, Guardian, October 2, 2001). The bombing of the Al-Shifa plant also resulted in the mass exodus of Sudan’s international organizations. Human Rights Watch observed that because of the bombing, “all UN agencies based in Khartoum have evacuated their American staff, as have many other relief organizations.” Because of this “many relief efforts have been postponed indefinitely, including a crucial one run by the U.S.- based International Rescue Committee are dying daily.” Additionally, “the UN estimates that 2.4 million people are at risk of starvation,” and the “disruption in assistance” for the “devastated population” may produce a “terrible crisis.” Therefore, it is not so surprising that Osama Bin Laden’s popularity rose after the Al-Shifa bombing. - http://www.causes-of-terrorism.net/usviolence.htm

He made a horrible mistake, because he thought the pharmaceutical factory had ties to Osama Bin Laden and was producing VX Nerve gas.

You believe Clinton was 'duped' and 'misled', rather than actively trying to distract attention from his own scandal (about which he repeatedly lied under oath, if you recall) because you are personally attracted to the man. This is the same mindset you would fall all over yourself decrying if you met a fan of Bush (although they're pretty hard to come by). What reason do we have to believe that Clinton honestly thought this was a terrorist operation? Does it even matter? His action resulted in untold death and destruction, and was a major factor in putting Osama bin Laden in the position to attack the United States.

That's precisely the thing: I don't defend Bush. I never have. Bush is indefensible. And, for the record, I voted for Gore in 2000 and Kerry in 2004. I'm not the problem here. I'm not the one salivating over Clinton because he has a practiced speaking voice and looks good on TV. He's a mass murderer.

If our foreign policy is what upsets you, not the political party currently resident in the White House, you should stop pretending that Clinton is some great peace-loving Democrat. He murdered innocent people to try to minimize his own embarrassment. That's his legacy.

I hate Clinton. Ask that SOB about his inaction in Rwanda and his cowardice in Somalia, and now he walks around like the Saviour of the African people.

now thats how a president should talk

Clinton's really a fuck. You shouldn't confuse dislike of Bush for a like of Clinton. Tillerman is basically right. What if some other country 'accidentally' wiped out half of the US's pharmacutical capacity? Would you just forgive them, say, "oh well, we all make mistakes"? Or would you ask why that country thinks it has the right to bomb another country whenever it wants?

Hind sight is 20/20, but if you look at the evidence (that the shit-tastic CIA provided) it was an action that any president would have made.

1) empta, a product of VX nerve gas, was found in the waste of the plant. (This is said not to be true because the studies carried out after the bombings by an independent organization found no empta in the soil. However this is shady because the tests were ordered privately by Idris’ lawyers. Also Empta can be detected up to a month in the soil, and the CIA studies were conducted 2 years before the bombing.

2) The owner, who bought the plant 5 months before the bombings, was suspected to have ties with Osama Bin Laden, who was seeking chemical weapons. And Upon finding out that Idris, the new owner, was not financed by Osama bin Laden, considered him to be a front man. In fact he did have commercial links to Sudan's Military Industrial Corp, a corporation responsible for producing chemical weapons, and bin laden also provided financing to this company.

3) This attack was a response to the two attacks on US embassies in Africa. If not legitimate, it was a fucking mistake. You have solid evidence from 2 years before the attack. Bin Laden cleans house, appoints another owner, and everything is sun and rainbows. Clinton doesn’t even challenge the lawsuit, learns from his actions and devotes the rest of his life to helping out Africa, and is somehow responsible for the crisis in Sudan?!

You’re fucking kidding me. Look at this on a national scale. If this is what makes Clinton a bad president, then I’ll just stick with the lesser of the evils and still support him. And this simply shows a wise president who also learns from his mistakes, when’s the last time we’ve had one of those?

Just to throw my two cents into this debate, the current Sudan crisis and the supposed causes of terrorism are not directly related. Certainly, one tactical strike against a radical group will incite hostilities - stir up the proverbial hornet's nest - but the current Sudanese crises is incongruous to terrorism in the United States. The crises has more to do with resources, ethnicity and religion than the United States.

Can a baby be born with AIDs as opposed to just HIV?

Usually the transmission of the Human Immunodeficiency Virus occurs in utero, but I haven't really heard of or read a child being born with AIDS. That could just be my lack of education on this subject. Something I do know is that not everyone who has HIV gets AIDS.

TeaBagger:

Oh my God, do you call that a source? I have asked you before to name some of your primary news sources so I guess this is one of them: a web page! You are such a joke. My only question is who/what leads you to all of your crackpot views on the new world order, or whatever you clowns are calling it these days.

My suggestion is that you start reading some real news for a change, or at least read a little real news to balance out all of the ridiculous crap you now rely on for information.

The bottom line, the undisputed truth, is that Clinton is well-respected worldwide. The people’s view of our former president reflects well on our nation. It’s not like I supported everything the guy did but that’s only because I have a brain, unlike the hard-core Bush people who are like vassals of a Japanese feudal lord.

The Onion had the best line about Clinton when Bush was elected, “America’s 8 Year Nightmare of Peace and Prosperity is Finally Over!"

mike says "his cowardice in Somalia"

Of course it was the Rethuglican cowards in congress that demanded that Clinton withdraw the troops from Somalia because of a few military casualties.

But the Rethuglicans don't care about nearly 4,000 in Iraq. Actually, Clinton's policy in Somalia was doing rather well until the Rethugs decided to cut and run.

Wingnuts like to bring up Rwanda, but not talk about Bosnia, where Clinton succeeded once again. Now, Bush has had years to do something about Dafur, but he has just sat on his hands.

@Dan,

This is why I would choose Hillary over anyone else. With Bill Clinton at Hillary's side, why would we need Obama or Edwards? [...] I realized I relate to him more than any other politician.

After seeing this video I had the exact same thought! I wasn't a huge Hillary fan until that thought dawned on me: Bill Clinton in the White House again! Thanks for the link too.

TeaForTheTillerman,

Clinton is a Mass Murderer!? What are you smoking and where can I get some of it? Wow. Now I know why Dzwonka flipped out on the other thread: you come up with some weird fucking analogies! Do you belong to the consiracy of the month club, or what?

To be fair, the website from which Tea/Till drew is not altogether a crazy one. That article happens to be one among ten others not relating to US aggression in painting a picture of terrorism.

"One purpose of this site is to show you that terrorism is not simply a struggle between good guys and bad guys." And terrorism is not even the main point of the whole site. It's just a lot of articles with differing views on some major topics. Kind of interesting.

But then, Tea/Till goes and does what any troll would do and takes a certain bit out of context that would be useful to him to make a point, or seem smarter/better informed/transcendentally objective and totally free from inferior, reason-clouding emotion or feeling. Give me a break, man.

I gave this site up for a while because of the forum trolls; for every right-leaning sane person who provoked interesting discussion, there were three chumps who kept coming back and seemed to love saying stuff to get rises out of people.

I suppose you have the right to say whatever you want. It's just frustrating sometimes when people seem to be stirring trouble for trouble's sake.

Oh my God, do you call that a source?

The Sudanese owner of a pharmaceutical plant destroyed by U.S. cruise missiles is seeking $50 million in compensation on the ground that his Khartoum factory was targeted because of false charges that it had terrorist links. - Associated Press

According to Kamm, I "deployed fanciful arithmetic to draw an equivalence" between 9-11 and Clinton's destruction of the al-Shifa pharmaceutical plant, which produced half of Sudan's supplies. The equivalence is, again, his fanciful construction. Discussing the "horrendous crime" committed on 9-11 with "wickedness and awesome cruelty," I mentioned that the toll may be comparable to the consequences of Clinton's bombing of the Sudan, about which I said nothing further. - Noam Chomsky (who, by the way, I fucking hate and would never quote unless he was stating fact)

The Clinton people are going to say that there is no connection between Iraq and al Qaeda. This is interesting since documents and intelligence used to bomb the al Shifa plant in Sudan in 1998 were based on that very information. Osama bin Laden had invested money in the Sudan factory and it was believed that a chemical compound called EMPTA, whose only function is to make VX nerve gas, was being made there. Several telephone calls between that plant and Baghdad were also intercepted. - Barbara J. Stock

“Because of a cupful of soil, the U.S. flattened this Sudanese factory. Now one of the world’s most respected labs, and some of Washington’s most expensive lawyers, say Salah Idris wasn’t making nerve gas for terrorists, just ibuprofen for headaches - Washington Post

Chemical weapons experts believe the evidence presented so far is not strong enough. They point out that key components of chemical weapons have ‘dual use’ and are also used in medicines, even bubble bath and shampoo. - The Independent

I could go on and on. The facts are on record for this - it takes two seconds to Google it. But I guess moronic plays on my chosen nickname are more compelling for someone of your intelligence.

Bill Clinton authorized the bombing of a pharmaceutical plant based on shoddy, half-read evidence. When your kind are willing to admit this fact, you claim he did it because he was 'mistaken', I think he did it to draw attention away from his own scandal - but the result is what matters: the current human rights crisis in the Sudan. He is largely responsible for the situation. 'Respected around the world'? Only by uninformed people. Our enemies certainly had no love for Clinton. That's why they were bombing our assets during his presidency as well.

That is the difference between you and me. Where I come to the table with logic, reason, and well-researched arguments, you slouch up with childish name-calling and bullheaded ideology. It would annoy me if it didn't help reveal to the world just how full of shit you smug, self-righteous liberal idealogues are.

Hi TeaForTheTillerman,

Clinton made a mistake on this and admitted it. Bush and Cheney have yet to say they made a mistake, on the contrary, they fooled the US on purpose.

Clinton lied about a blowjob. Bush and Co. lied to get us into a war.

I see a difference there.

I don't think Clinton did it to avoid a scandal, and your saying that he did is just an opinion.

Clinton is not the cause of the current human rights situation in Sudan. Can you provide evidence for this?

...you slouch up with childish name-calling and bullheaded ideology. It would annoy me if it didn't help reveal to the world just how full of shit you smug, self-righteous liberal idealogues are.

• I don't think much of the world comes here and I think you've pinpointed exactly why... If they do, then it's for the Jon Stewart videos.

goodbye.

What is amazing is this never-ending personal responsability stance (related to christian culpability): "How Each of Us Can Change the World" although we know how big companies and financial interests shape our world.

Of course, personal consumer's habits make a difference, but I fear that nowadays, most of humans just want a nice consumer's life, giving an appreciative and good-conscious nod to Clinton's blabla...

Pessimistic, I am, pessismistic I remain even after hearing all these good intentions.

Well-researched? Logic? Reason? I’m sorry but I don’t see it in what you write in this forum—perhaps you have a separate, parallel forum where you are reasonable and employ logic and facts. You call Clinton a mass murderer; that’s just crazy talk. I would defend Bush against that sort of nonsense claim and I have opposed every single thing he has done as president. To insist that Clinton bombed anything to cover up for his sexual misconduct is ludicrous—par for the course for your remarks.

Your biggest problem is that you don’t seem to know the difference between journalism and opinion-editorial. You are quoting Noam Chomsky as one of your sources? I would never do that and I’m as liberal and smug as it gets. Does this mean that I can start quoting him in my arguments? This is all opinion, you fool. The fact is that Bill Clinton left this country in better shape than when he found it. Balanced Budget? Remember that? You can look up that fact; it’s not an opinion.

Respected around the world'? Only by uninformed people.

So anyone who disagrees with you is wrong or uninformed. This perfectly illustrates your childish world view.

TeaBagger:

But I guess moronic plays on my chosen nickname are more compelling for someone of your intelligence.

And I suppose all of your name calling (smug, full of shit, assholes, self-righteous liberal idealogues [sic], etc.) demonstrates your own superior intelligence?

Interesting how a President's influence is only partly political but to a larger extent psychological. Bill reminds me of what it was like to hear a President talk who made you feel better about your country and the world. When Bush speaks I either feel 1.) embarrassed and hope that other nations hearing him don't think all Americans are that stupid. 2.) Angry for his flimsy deceit that even a blind man should now be able to see through or 3.) Afraid because of the fear-mongering that has so characterized his Presidency, both before and after 9/11. Bill Clinton simply gives you reasons, and factually sound ones, why an average person can take some sense of hope from the current state of the world and perhaps do something to improve it. When people feel good about the world and the future they work harder, take risks on vital things like starting their own businesses or buying their own homes, and think more clearly about the news presented them. Mr. Clinton is becoming the Democratic Ronald Reagan icon. The major difference being that Reagan told lots of nice sounding lies about a return to "good-old-days" that never actually existed whereas Bill Clinton tells verifiable truths about a brighter future that we can actually have. I feel good after I hear this man speak. And, he was interview for 24 minutes by Letterman and never once murdered the English language or stepped into an overt lie. G.W. Bush could not make a 2 minute speach without doing one or both of the above. I'm definitely voting for Hillary now, though I retain my reservations.

Clinton was a great president and now an even better ex-president. He is a credit to our nation.

I linked to your blog; want to link to mine?